Flying in Canada? There’s a new rule that prohibits airlines from charging particularly large passengers an extra fee for taking up more than one seat.
The Canadian Transportation Agency ruling Thursday gives Air Canada, Air Canada Jazz and WestJet one year to bring in a “one-person, one-fare” policy.
The ruling applies to disabled people, including the severely obese, who require two seats to accommodate them. It also applies to disabled persons who need an attendant seated with them on flights.
[...]
The agency estimates the new policy will cost Air Canada about $6.93 million a year, and WestJet about $1.48 million a year. That amounts to about 77 Canadian cents a ticket for Air Canada and 44 Canadian cents for WestJet.
In the U.S., Southwest has been charging an extra fee for some time (but only when flights are booked solid). They’ve been sued at least once, but the practice persists. It’s not just a North American thing, either: Air France was also sued for charging a passenger for an extra seat.
Lawsuits have typically charged discrimination, and that’s how the Canadian rule is framed.
My own view: It’s fine to give an oversized person a seat for the price of one ticket, as long as the other passengers aren’t required to give up their space. 17 inches width is little enough, that should be a minimum we fight to uphold.
But what do YOU think? Is Canada’s new policy fair or not? Should other countries follow suit? Are airlines doing enough?
Vote in the poll, and hit the comments with your thoughts.
(Reading via the feed? Trouble reading the poll? Try here.)
Related:
- Travel by the pound
- Southwest’s “customer of size” Q&A
(Thanks again to reader J!)
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January 13th, 2008 at 11:48 pm
There are a couple of problems. Airlines are notorious for passing costs on to customers. By giving 100% the seat for 0% more dollars, they’re incurring a cost, and that cost WILL be passed on to the fitter customers, especially if the practice becomes enshrined and airlines start to plan ahead for it. I for one have a big problem paying for others’ deficiencies (or in this case, abundancies).
Moreover, there’s a potential other danger here. If an airline does simply charge standard fare for a person taking up more than one seat, they could feel justified in not making any effort to spare neighboring passengers this inconvenience by treating them, for seating purposes, as any other passenger. That is to say, they might just go “Oh, he’s spilling into your seat? Too bad. He paid for one seat so he gets one seat.” And that would make for some mighty unhappy passengers.
January 14th, 2008 at 5:49 am
At JFK back in 2001, I saw an extremely obese couple bitch and moan at the United gate staff because they were in Economy and there was “no way that they were going to fit into those tiny seats, so they had better be upgraded to Business Class.”
These 2 were so big that they could hardly walk. Every 10 steps required a rest and puff on an asthma inhaler.
They got the upgrade. As we filed onto an extremely full plane to LAX, there they were – sitting back, each sipping on 2 glasses of OJ and 2 glasses of champagne – because 1 each wasn’t big enough.
If I had been the gate staff, I would have upgraded the people who were due to sit next to them and given the obese couple 2 Economy seats each.
January 14th, 2008 at 8:30 am
It all comes down to whether or not you think obesity is a disability or not. Look at the quote, “disabled people, including the severely obese”.
I know some obese folks who tell me that it’s not their choice to be fat. I’m not sure if it matters, really, if it’s a choice or not. In the US, and seemingly in Canada, once you’re considered to have a disability, then you are granted some leeway, which makes sense to me. Does it matter how you got disabled? Do people ask how someone got into a wheelchair? No, they see you’re in a wheelchair and they accomodate. Why are obese people treated any differently?
So I voted “fair.” Raise ticket prices 71 cents or whatever to cover the cost.
But I’ve got one caveat: The second seat the large traveler gets had better be empty. and not mine.
January 14th, 2008 at 10:13 am
I voted fair, but I certainly don’t think it’s a black and white issue. I like nzm’s suggestion of upgrading others to first class though.
I don’t want to sit beside someone who takes too much room, but I also don’t want to sit beside someone who may smell or cough incessantly from smoking. But would the airline charge that person for 2 tickets because they hadn’t showered or taken cough syrup before boarding the plane?
I think the Canadian ruling puts the onus back onto the airline’s shoulders to do something – which they won’t, of course. But it does make them clearly accountable to their customers.
Julia Rosien
Editor, http://www.gogirlfriend.com
January 14th, 2008 at 12:44 pm
Julia sez I also don’t want to sit beside someone who may smell.
For the record, United (and perhaps other carriers I haven’t checked on) expressly reserves the right, in its contract of carriage (see Rule 35) to deny boarding to “PERSONS WHO HAVE A MALODOROUS CONDITION OTHER THAN INDIVIDUALS QUALIFYING AS DISABLED).”
I’d hate to be the gate agent responsible for making that judgment call, though.
January 14th, 2008 at 2:04 pm
personally i think only people who have a doctor’s note to prove that their obesity in a medical condition can be subject to “one person one fare” rule, since their obesity is mostly out of their control.
for those couch potatoes who just don’t take care of themselves and expect everyone else to suffer from their own lifestyles, they should be subject to “one seat one fare” instead.
January 14th, 2008 at 3:41 pm
More importantly, is height an affliction or disablity too? I can certainly not control this and at 6’3″ i never can get enough legroom.
January 14th, 2008 at 4:06 pm
I spy some good ideas. Especially the part about the cause of the disability. If obesity was incurred by result of irresponsible eating, and/or laziness, and other disabilities were caused by foolish behavior such as anything Darwin Award-worthy, then no extra concessions should be made.
January 16th, 2008 at 1:28 am
Lots of good comments, nzm and jk in particular. I’m fine with forking over 77 cents extra (Canadian, no less. Oh wait, they’re almost the same now) so that every sized person only has to pay for one seat. But I don’t want to fork over any of my 17 inches!
January 18th, 2008 at 4:16 pm
By making the airlines universally responsible for providing “passengers of size” with the room they require, we all benefit. No longer will there be the temptation for the airlines to force POS into single seats next to non-POS. I yearn for the day when the US implements this policy. As long as the extra seat is reserved ahead of time so other passengers are not bumped from their reserved seat, I encourage this.
February 16th, 2008 at 11:42 am
In the free world people should have the right to travel without being judged, or charged, for how they look, how they move, what they eat, or their lifestyle. It seems easy to point fingers and presume weakness. Fat people suffer from discrimination in the workplace, on the street, in the medical world, and on all types of transportation systems. Just because procrustean airlines have chosen some very restrictive dimensions for seats in order to maximize profit by comfortably accommodating only average-sized and smaller people does not mean the odd fat or disabled person who needs more room is a substantial contributor to so-called lost revenue. Shame on anyone who presumes to judge and demand doctor’s notes. If it’s so easy to change your body, why don’t you just lose a few inches so you can better accommodate those around you? Then go lobby the airlines for a discount due to your svelte figure and see how far you get. And while you’re at it, ask for a surcharge for taller people whose knees bump the back of your seat. I have flown for many years and suspect there are on average perhaps one or two obese passengers on any given Canadian flight (if that). Two larger economy seats installed in place of one three seat section would probably allow nearly everyone to be accommodated just fine. It is hideously uncomfortable and embarrassing to try and wedge oneself into a too-small seat. Nobody wants to sit on someone else’s seat, so just give everyone a place they fit and viva la difference!
April 10th, 2008 at 3:30 am
[...] 4. Canada prohibits airlines from charging overweight passengers for an extra seat [Upgrade: Travel Better] [...]
June 9th, 2008 at 6:08 pm
reply to Courtnay: Why should an obese person get to sit in a larger more comfortable seat for the same price that I paid? If it is uncomfortable and embarrassing to fit into a small seat, then buy two seats. I no longer fly coach anywhere, and believe me, I have to sacrifice to afford the higher fare. If I can’t afford the first class fare, I don’t fly, period. I am sick and tired of being wedged in like a tiny sardine between overweight people that don’t care that they are spilling into my seat, sweating on me, and infringing on my personal space. I even had an obese woman argue with me once, because I refused to let her put her carry on bag under my feet on my side, because she had two bags and no space on her side. If you have flown in the last decade then you are aware of the size of the airplane seats, an obese person knows they won’t fit in their seat when they book their flight. Stop being in denial and deal with your weight. Isn’t it is more embarrassing to sit wedged next to a stranger that is glaring at you the whole trip than it would be to pay for and have two seats to yourself in comfort.
July 7th, 2008 at 5:41 pm
It should be determined ahead of time if the person is going to need more seats and they should have to pay an extra fee. Maybe not the cost of an entire seat, but at least enough to offset the incured cost everybody else has to put up for thier obese lifestlye. This isn’t about discrimination it is about resources, a 400lb man is going to need more fuel and more space than a 150lb man… why shouldn’t they have to pay more?
August 12th, 2008 at 4:22 pm
I think that a overweight person should have to pay for an extra seat if they dont want to be stuffed in their seat. How is it fair to everyone else that has to sit next to them when they are taking up all this room. If i want to be more comforable i have to pay extra for first class .. so whyy would it be different for them they want to be comforable they should pay for it to. Most people are just lazy and eat mcdonalds and junk and dont exercise i dont feel sorry for them at all that is their chose to live and be unhealthy so i feeL that they should pay for 2 seats.
they may say its like a disability … but thats honestly the funniest thing ill ever heard just because you choose to eat and your fat are we suppose to feel sorry for you.
Airlines will be losing money if they have say even 3 obese people on the plane thats 6 seats thats 3 extra seats they could have someone pay for… everyone has their own option but i dont think its fair that they get special treatment because they are obese. People in wheel chairs or other issues cant change the way they are but obese people can and most choose not to.
October 17th, 2008 at 5:41 am
Seriously obese people aren’t handicapped. They got that way one bite at a time. I see so many fat people, mostly women, these days with walking canes to help with shot knees. One did not see this 20 years ago when fewer people allowed themselves to get so overweight. I saw a special group of cruise passengers who were “handicapped” riding around on their electric people movers. They weren’t handicapped… just too lazy to get up and walk like the rest of us. Make the fatties pay for an extra seat. They already pay 3 times what the rest of us pay to eat anyway. If they don’t like it, they can stay home on their couch and become more potato like:)
January 12th, 2009 at 6:47 am
[...] seat. The court reaffirmed the Department of Transport’s “one person, one seat” directive. Air Canada and WestJet, Canada’s top airlines, in turn decided that passengers would need a [...]
January 20th, 2010 at 12:15 pm
All the comments have merit, but how about how about people with gene or genetic problems and are overweight not of their own doing? I’m in Canada, and agree that if it’s your own doing then fine you pay more, and don’t ever whine that you need to be upgraded if I’m standing behind you.
Do we all not pay extra for overweight baggage, then the same should be implemented for gross obesity if it’s not caused by a medical condition. I as well was at the Chicago airport, and a 400+ lb. guy wanted an extra seat free so he’d be comfortable. The young lady stated their policy was that he had to pay for another seat. She did then state that this plane was full except for first class and she’d be happy to sell him an upgrade if he wished, to applause from other customers in line.
March 21st, 2010 at 10:49 am
You people are the reason why the world is the way it is. My sister has a sever thyroid deficency that makes her gain weight no matter what she does. That isnt a medical condition? And to John who thinks he knows so much about people and how they got to their size….you should do some research and see that thigns arent always black and white. You have way too much to say about poeple and calling someone a fatty is racisit. Are you out there calling other groups that you dont think are right names? You all make me sick and its no wonder why so many children are bulimic and anorexic no adays.
April 15th, 2010 at 11:59 pm
I am the fat person who sits next to you and spills over onto your seat. As I sit down and make myself comfortable for the loooong journey ahead of us, I notice for a moment that my thigh is grazing yours. I do my best impression of making it look like I’m trying to squish over onto my seat, but that is really just for show; I know full well I haven’t budged. I then ask myself the same question I do at this stage of every journey I make by air, “where is that girl with the drink cart? And when do we get to eat?”
February 3rd, 2011 at 5:45 pm
Simple: charging for two seats (especially when your second seat can actually STILL BE SOLD) is discrimination regardless of how you look at it. You can look at it two ways:
One: people have different body shapes and, as the science tells us, it’s not their fault they are fat.. therefore you are charging people double for how they were born- for something that’s not a choice and not in their control. For the people who are among the super obese due to eating disorders or mental/emotional problems then you’re discriminating against people who are ill- which is still unacceptable. This option is what the science tells us: that fatties can exercise and eat well and still not be thin- and still be “spilling over” even.
Two: weight is completely within a person’s control and those fatties should lose weight if they want to pay the same- which means that being fat automatically means that you have to work and struggle and be deprived and put excessive energy every single day of your life into looking like the thinner person just to be treated the same as they get to be treated with little or no effort. Requiring one group of people do entirely change their lifestyle just to be treated equally is discrimination. Why can a thin person sit on the couch and eat pizza every day and not be discriminated against but when a fat person does it they’re allowed to be more degraded even when the lifestyle is EXACTLY THE SAME?
February 24th, 2011 at 5:30 pm
I have no issue with pay by the pound. I get pulled aside by “Betty by the books” at the ticket desk for my checked baggage being over by 1lb. Why do I have to pay $20-50per bag when people are the major contributor to the weight of the plane. If you are overweight you should pay a surcharge per pound for every pound over the national average. If you make another person uncomfortable by encroaching on their space, you should be forced to move or pay a second seat. It is only fair. It isnt descrimination when a person has to be a certain weight or height to ride a carnival ride, it’s safety. If you use the safety plug anything is legal.
March 31st, 2011 at 9:27 am
Like one person said, there are medical conditions that contribute to obesity. Thyroid conditions, having to take steroids for medical conditions, even severe depression can contribute to obesity. I know of people who drank and drove and put themselves in the wheelchair due to their own drunk driving accident. Would you deny them a disability label for travel? I don’t think so, we wouldn’t dare ask how someone winds up in a wheelchair and judge them over it. If a doctor has identified someone obese as having a disability then they have a disability, plain and simple and should be treated fairly as a person with a disability.
July 13th, 2011 at 12:01 pm
Ouch ouch ouch!! Some of you really sound judgmental.
To begin with, I am a somewhat skinny guy married to an overweight person flirting with obesity. One thing I have come to realize, even if it is certainly not true for myself, is that losing weight is hard for some people. This is hard for me to understand sometimes, but it is true.
I also realize, though, that some people make excessive excuses for obesity, as if it just happened. If you exercise, and eat normally, it is practically impossible to get obese unless you have some sort of thyroid problem etc. In 90% of cases, there are practices which, if started young, will lead to a healthy life. This is not a moral issue. It is a public health one.
To the problem at hand. To me, it makes sense not to charge obese people extra. This really is a minor problem — how many obese persons have you sat next to? More importantly, as an airline passenger, you should want to NOT sit crammed into a seat next to an obese person who can’t fit in one seat! You should want to encourage a practice that is in the self-interest of other passengers.
That being said, bumping someone up to First/ Business class to get a bigger seat is unfair to the rest of us, I like the suggestion, above, that someone sitting next to an overweight person might get the upgrade.
As for the idea of charging passengers by the pound — humans aren’t cattle, and should not be treated that way. We don’t charge by the pound (of the eater) in restaurants. Buses don’t charge person by their weight. Health insurance premiums don’t depend on your size. Why should airlines be different?